WATER START UP RECOMMENDATION
Published on by Esther Roger
My name is Esther Roger, and I'm an entrepreneur based in Barcelona. I'm currently exploring the possibility of setting up water fountains connected to the city's water system, equipped with reverse osmosis filters.
The project aims to establish several refill points across Barcelona, providing citizens with access to great-tasting drinking water. To achieve this, it's crucial that the osmosis filters have the capacity to purify a significant amount of water daily, without the need for frequent filter changes. Each station should have its own efficient system, occupying minimal space.
Additionally, I envision these fountains offering more than just natural drinking water. I'd like to incorporate options for sparkling and flavored water (for instance, two flavors), giving users a range of choices.
I've been recommended to reach out to you for guidance in developing this project. I would be truly honored if you could provide me with some insights and expertise.
I eagerly await your response.
Thank you very much,
Esther Roger
Taxonomy
- Water
- Water Supply
- Drinking Water
- water treatment
- Water
- Water
- Water
- Water Advisor
- Water
- Water Purification
- water, wastewater, reclaimed water, water resources planning
- Water Utility
- water
13 Answers
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Esther. Your initiative to provide clean and flavorful drinking water to citizens is commendable. Given your goals, here's a more tailored approach to guide you through the development of your water fountain project:
Project Scope and Goals:
- Clearly define the scope of your project. How many refill points are you planning to set up across Barcelona? Are there specific neighborhoods or areas you're targeting?
- Outline your primary goals: providing clean and great-tasting water, promoting sustainability, reducing single-use plastic consumption, and enhancing the overall drinking water experience for citizens.
Reverse Osmosis Filtration System:
- Collaborate with water filtration experts to design a robust reverse osmosis system that can handle the daily water purification requirements for each refill point. Consider the water quality and consumption patterns in different areas of the city.
- Ensure the system is equipped with pre-filtration mechanisms to extend the life of the reverse osmosis membranes and reduce maintenance needs.
Efficiency and Maintenance:
- Choose high-quality reverse osmosis membranes and filters that can handle a substantial daily water purification load, minimizing the need for frequent replacements.
- Implement monitoring and maintenance protocols to track filter performance and address any issues promptly. Remote monitoring could be considered to streamline maintenance efforts.
Compact Design and Space Utilization:
- Collaborate with industrial designers to create a space-efficient and visually appealing fountain design that can accommodate the filtration system and dispensing mechanisms while blending seamlessly into urban environments.
Sparkling and Flavored Water Options:
- Work with beverage experts to develop the infrastructure needed for providing sparkling and flavored water options. This involves integrating carbonation systems and flavor infusion mechanisms.
- Design user-friendly interfaces that allow users to easily select their preferred water type (still, sparkling, flavored) and flavor options.
Sustainability and User Experience:
- Incorporate eco-friendly materials and energy-efficient components to align with sustainability goals.
- Focus on user experience by ensuring intuitive operation, quick dispensing, and clear instructions for choosing water options.
Partnerships and Regulations:
- Collaborate with local authorities, water utility companies, and health regulators to ensure compliance with water quality and safety standards.
- Explore partnerships with local businesses, NGOs, and community organizations to garner support and promote the use of your refill stations.
Pilot Testing and Feedback:
- Conduct a pilot test in a select few locations to gather user feedback and identify any operational challenges or improvements needed before scaling up.
Promotion and Awareness:
- Develop a marketing and awareness campaign to inform citizens about the benefits of your refill stations and encourage their use. Highlight the environmental impact and convenience of your initiative.
Scaling and Expansion:
- Based on the success of the pilot, scale up the project to cover more locations across Barcelona, gradually expanding your network of refill points.
Remember, successful execution requires a multidisciplinary approach, involving experts in water filtration, industrial design, beverage production, and public health. By focusing on innovation, sustainability, and user convenience, you can create a project that benefits both the citizens and the environment. Good luck with your endeavor, Esther!
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I have a simple solution for you that we manufacture in the USA. One box and 1 to 3 filters. Cost effective. Please advise. Bill
1 Comment
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Hi Bill, I have just send you an email through your company website Pure- a- Five to request more info.
Thanks,
Esther Roger
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Dear Esther Roger,
Despite their higher initial cost, RO water purifiers will be preferable solutions for your project.
I suggested to you to uses High Recovery Reverse Osmosis systems over traditional reverse osmosis systems because it use less chemicals, maximize the capacity of the treatment system, and significantly reduce the amount of water that is rejected. However, the effectiveness of the water purification will depend on your raw water water quality paramter.
Regarding the flavored water, it is difficult to get it after filtration, therefore you need to use a chemical to get the required product water into the fountain.
Please contact me at [wtnsae,ak@gmail.com] if you need further information on HR-RO.
Good Luck!
2 Comments
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our system is maximum thruput. we do not use salt. we can purify practically any water almost gallon for gallon at much less cost than any RO system.We will soften, purify and filter all the water. No reject line is necessary
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Firstly, thank you for the reply. I have just send you and email.
Thanks,
Esther
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Where is the demand for your proposition? Barcelona city water meets veey high standards and is drunk by millions. It does not require further RO treatment (about which others have already commented on its unsuitability). Moreover, most of it has been produced by RO! From an operational perspective, how do propose plumbing this into the city's water system, permitting, site security and acquiring the rights to use the public space on which these fountaIns will be installed? Who is going to maintain them? From the perspective of your business model, what is the pricing/revenue/cost/financial model? If I need to drink when I am in the street I carry water with me or buy it from a store (or carbonated drinks/sodas etc.). So what is the value proposition you are offering?
1 Comment
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Dear Mr. Bacon,
Thank you for your reply. I agree with you that the water in Barcelona meets very high standards and is drunk by many people. However, I believe that there is an opportunity to improve the way that people access and consume water in the city.
As you mentioned, many homes, offices, and restaurants install filter systems such as Reverse Osmosis to purify the water they are going to consume directly. This is because the taste of the water, although consumable (potable), is not good or pleasant (amount of chlorine, composition, etc.). For this reason, more and more private households or companies are installing these water consumption systems in their homes.
Another example is that if you need to drink water and you are in the street, you often buy a bottle of water (plastic) that is sold in the streets. This is because you do not like the taste of the fountains that are installed in the city, or because there is simply not enough network available for you to access easily.
Although there are numerous but not enough free public fountains around the city, they are not really used for the beneficial purpose of a public fountain: to supply water consumption without the need to buy bottles of water. The water from these fountains, most of the time, is used to give water to domestic animals to drink, to use it as water for washing, among others. It is not given the proper use it should really have for its function due to its taste among others.
This is a latent reality in the city of Barcelona and in other cities around the world. It increases the consumption of water bottles (made with single-use plastic) and with it, pollution. In addition, restaurants also have to buy single-use bottles (plastic or glass) from water suppliers, which leads to the use of non-recycled material (single-use) and also increases costs and pollution in terms of logistical resources (both to carry and to collect the supplied bottles).
My proposal is to create an application in which you can identify which points have installed this service (natural water, sparkling water, and flavored water) and where you can refill the portable bottles that I also want to supply. Thus, users or subscribers will be able to make use of them at a monthly/annual/ or single-use cost both around the city. Restaurants will also be able to benefit from it.
I have created a business model that I could send you for more extensive feedback. I would be happy to hear your recommendations.
Best regards,
Esther Roger
Email. estherrogerp@gmail.com
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You may want to discuss this with the municipality prior to starting a potentially failed startup. RO, as many pointed out, is not an optimal method (especially since the supply of water, I assume, is not from the sea and/or a brackish source). Thus, other techniques, if required, may serve you better. Are these fountains going to be a part of a thirst-quenching non-profit setup? If so, this is a beautiful venture. Check with the City (municipality), though. Good luck.
1 Comment
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You're right. The municipality in Barcelona, does not permit setting up adding water fountains connected to the city's water system in the public space. However, there are potential ways to address this issue and push for change and to begin this project:
1. Introduce an app with public refill stations: By creating an app that provides information about public refill stations, individuals can easily locate places where they can refill their water bottles. This encourages the use of existing water sources without relying on the city's water system.
2. Partner with private local refilling stations: Collaborating with private businesses that have their own water refilling stations can expand the availability of refill options. These stations can be equipped with technology and services that offer a variety of water options, such as still, sparkling, and flavored water refills.
By implementing these measures, it is possible to demonstrate the demand for accessible water refill options and highlight the need for change in the government's policies. This approach can help promote sustainable water consumption practices and reduce reliance on single-use plastic bottles.
It is important to note that the safety of drinking water from public fountains in Barcelona has been confirmed. Therefore, utilizing refill stations can provide a convenient and environmentally friendly alternative to purchasing bottled water.
Overall, by combining public refill stations through an app and partnering with private local refilling stations, it is possible to create a network of accessible and sustainable water sources. This can contribute to raising awareness about the importance of water conservation and potentially influence the government to reconsider their restrictions on water fountains in public spaces.
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.... I'm currently exploring the possibility of setting up water fountains connected to the city's water system, equipped with reverse osmosis filters.
Why would you even consider RO for this application. RO will remove about 80% of the dissolved solids at a very slow rate and at a great expense. I have seen cartridge softeners filled with ion exchange resin for this application. That would remove Calcium and Magnesium
....... great-tasting drinking water.No again! RO will lower the taste. Have some tests run on the P & M alkalinity and the pH of the water supply. Pure water is tasteless; the taste comes from the buffering agents: carbonates and bicarbonates that are found in spring water. You would lbe removing the taste with RO!
.....it's crucial that the o smosis filters have the capacity to purify a significant amount of water daily , without the need for frequent I would consider small cartridge filters to remove the fine particles found in water lines.; a combination filter containing arrbon would improve the taste. .........filter changes. Filter changes would depend upon water flow and filter size. It would be suggested that the size of the filter and the amount of flow could be matched to give about a monthly changeout.
Additionally, I envision these fountains offering more than just natural drinking water. I'd like to incorporate options for sparkling and flavored water (for instance, two flavors), giving users a range of choices.
.....sparkling water would use carbon dioxide injection into the water, as Coca Cola Pepsi do to get carbonic acid into the product.
.....Flavored water could be done with the use of a chemical injection pump activated by water flow But the flavor would have to be diluted before being placed on site and matched to the water flow. From a service standpoint, you would have to employ a service person capable of understanding the pump & flow service problems; a low cost worker for this would at some ppoint be a disaster.
1 Comment
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You're right. Therefore it is better to start firstly in the private sector because municpality in Spain blocks all this initiatives. Maybe in other cities it could be posible. I have to explore it.
Therefore, you suggest adding other types of filters such as cartridge softeners filled with ion exchange resin to remove calcium and magnesium. Also you suggest using small cartridge filters to remove fine particles found in water lines and a combination filter containing carbon to improve the taste. However my question is, why private sector still introduces RO to improve the taste of water if there are other options more efficient, less expensive and more sustainable?
Thank you,
Esther ROger
1 Comment reply
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The biggest difference between municipal services and private industry is that government services are supposed to provide the largest benefit to the most people for the least cost (even it that isn't how it always works out), and private industry simply wants to make some minimal profit with their investment (and more profit is always welcome).
For example, a city might provide many "free" outlets of "potable" water on every major city street block. The water is great for hydration, it won't promote or carry any diseases, it is readily available and at no cost (hidden in your taxes). However, its temperature may vary and no one is too concerned about the taste (if any).
A private enterprise would want to recover all costs in delivering water to anyone AND make some profit. So it not only needs to charge each user for the water, it needs to make the water MORE desirable than any other option in order to get people to pay for it. That is where issues of "taste" (and some mineral content is really preferred) and texture (temperature or carbonation) come in. Those of course may require additional equipment and maintenance expenditures which also need to be recovered and profited.
Now the private enterprise is free to experiment or study whether they can achieve their goal of a profitable water delivery service. If they think that it will work, they risk their own money to achieve it. If it doesn't look like a profitable venture, they will abandon it for something else.
WHAT technology or processes may be necessary, and what do they cost is where we get back to the basic question of what is the source (city water) and what is the desired final quality? If RO provides the best projected return on investment, they will go for it. Sometimes even that (the label) is valuable in marketing to obtain the desired price margin for profitability.
Best regards,
Steven
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Hola buen dia, es muy buena idea darle sabor al agua, aca ya en oficina tenemos dispensadores .Saludos
1 Comment
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La idea sería tenerlas no solo en espacios privados sino también al alcance de todos mientras caminamos por la calle. Gracias por el soporte!
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The city of Zurich has thousands of fountains that are connected to a separate system of wells. You may want to explore what other cities are doing in this reguard- the fountains are also used in summer by kids and adults alike to cool off.
1 Comment
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True. Moreover there are also other countries that have implemented this model but just with still water such as Japan, Italy or UK
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Dear Esther,
Others have correctly commented on the possible over-definition of the purification using RO. It will be best to start with the desired end product - including whether this would be FREE distribution or require a fee to obtain the water from the kiosks. Then the actual delivery process can start with the city water supply. Is it not adequate in terms of purity? If not, then as a city water supply, how does that affect other uses, and specifically, what would be the final purity requirements for your intended use? Is such a distribution regulated by local or other government ordinances?
I have extensive experience in localized carbonation for beverages, but that is simply an add-on to the water provided. That would certainly affect the cost of the installations and their continued maintenance. As a private venture that can be addressed by normal market forces. If it is part of a municipal benefit, the city may have its own specifications or restraints on installation cost and maintenance.
I can explore some of the general considerations of both the technical and business parts of such a venture in some more depth before it would warrant any formal contractual agreement. I may be contacted at drwhocooke@yahoo.com for further discussions.
Best regards,
Steven
1 Comment
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Thanks! I jsut sen you an email
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Dear Esther, I like this idea. I would guess there are some water quality requirements for this water at the point of use.
you have to ensure safe water for the citiziens as you claim the water fountain provides safe drinking water.
So please check the regulations and the needed treatment steps to provide the needed quality permanently. I agree with Alan the RO treatment is overdo.
1 Comment
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Both of you are right. As the water will come from public water supply there is no need for invest in this costly technology. However, what I continually ask for myself is why still private sector (homes, private business install this kind of technology in their homes if still they have potable water coming from the water tap. If's for the flavour of course but why to install an expensive technology if you can have a different taste with other cheaper resources?
I would love to hear from you back,
Thanks,
Esther Roger
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It's not obvious to me why these outlets require reverse osmosis treatment when they can use the piped water supply system of Barcelona that already provides drinking water to EU quality standards. Reverse osmosis is used to remove unwanted compounds from water, and may require much higher pressure than usually found in a municipal drinking water network, depending on the compounds it is desired to remove. Therefore each location could need an electricity power supply to power the reverse osmosis filtration. If the purpose of the reverse osmosis is to safeguard the health of users, then a much more serious issue is the design of the water delivery point - especially if these outlets are used by the general public and open to external contamination. Finally, water treated by reverse osmosis usually lacks non-harmful chemical constituents that make water taste good. Water utilities relying on reverse osmosis (for example to desalinate seawater) have to replace these compounds to restore hardness and make the water potable.
1 Comment
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Hi Alan,
You are right. In addition, since the water in EU cities is potable, what would be needed is a license to install these fountains in public spaces with the necessary technology to provide these flavored services (natural, sparkling and flavored water). The possibility of introducing hot water for countries where it is colder could also be considered.
As the water it will be provided by public and, therfore, has to meet quality standars there is no need to invest such a technology as RO. However it is good to improve taste or provide better qualities for it or give more 'flavour oprtions as I mentioned before.
For electricity supply I have considered other options that we also can discuss.
What do you recommend then? What possibilities would you consider?
Please, I would like to hear your advice.
Thank you very much,
Esther Roger
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HI. There are other methods for desalination (removing salinity and salts) of water. Reverse osmosis is only one method and its cost is high.
1 Comment
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Hi Alireza, can you give me more info about it? Thanks,
Esther Roger
1 Comment reply
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Hi Esther , Sent to your email.
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Please contact me at durga.das@gmail.com or on +91 9884422270 via whatsApp. We can discuss possibilities
1 Comment
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Just send you an email. Kind regards
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